Re:

[Neon]

Scuzzy,

Coupla questions...What sort of purchase qualifies for getting the OEM version of Windows? Is there any difference for 98/ME/2K/XP?



Do you plan to buy the HSF separately and mount it yourself? This is supposed to be the trickiest part of putting Athlon systems together, and I am considering getting a HSF/CPU package dealie. Do you think that's a good idea, or is the difficuly level of mounting the HSF exaggerated?



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[pat]

This quote from atomic park:

What is OEM?? OEM, or Original Equipment Manufacturer, software is completely electronic, there are no manuals or retail boxes to manufacture and distribute - All you recieve is the CD-ROM of the software, except in the case of operating systems - where you recieve a small start-up guide. Keep in mind that the entire users manual is installed onto your computer during the software's installation process. This electronic manual is stored in the "Help" section, just as you see along the drop down menus of the Internet Explorer or Netscape Navigator browser you are using right now. It has a complete index, searchable index, and sections that you can print out. The help menus have been so descriptive that customers who have purchased the software with manuals, end up hardly using them.



Our OEM products are sold with hardware, in order to abide with the license agreements established by the software manufacturers. The cost of this hardware is already included in the price of your product, so there is not any additional charges that you will incur by recieving this software/hardware package. Those customers that are registered at www.microsoft.com/oem are not required to have their OEM product accompanied with hardware. Because of this, the prices on those packages can be obtained at a slightly lower cost. Please call our customer service center on 888.322.4250 and a representative will be happy to assist you.

 





 

[scuzzy]

Patman and Neon,



I bought Windows XP Professional OEM from NewEgg.com (see a couple of my poasts above). The cost of the software was $150, and required the purchase of *any* piece of hardware from NewEgg, regardless of price.



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Alex Garcia

[scuzzy]

Neon,



My understanding is that you need to know what you're doing when install a heat sink/fan on AMD chips. If not done properly, it's likely that the CPU will fry. I decided on the retail (boxed) version mostly for the 3 year warranty. It's also nice that the retail version already has the fan mounted, but that's not the primary reason I bought it.



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Alex Garcia

[Neon]

quote:The cost of the software was $150, and required the purchase of *any* piece of hardware from NewEgg, regardless of price.

EXCELLENT! So there is no minimum hardware purchase, I could just buy a $10 floppy drive to be eligible for the OEM version of Windows XP, and save about $150. Seems a bit loopholey, but there's just another reason America is great.



Having read a few tales of woe by people who *crushed* their brand new Athlon while trying to put the heatsink on, I am rather chickenhearted to attempt this, especially since it would be my first attempt. Yup, it looks like the pre-mounted heatsink option is the way to go.



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Edited by - Neon on Oct 11 2001  9:50:17 PM

[John]

Scuzzy, you probably mentioned this but what heatsink and fan are you going to use.



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John

[scuzzy]

John,



If I buy the retail version (which I'm planning on doing), it will come from the factory with heatsink and fan preinstalled. I believe AMD is using Delta fans, but I don't know for sure.



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Alex Garcia

[John]

Scuzzy, how about a CPU Shim I don't know a lot about this product other than what I know about displacing heat. Have you considered this product.



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John

[scuzzy]

John, I don't know anything about CPU Shims. Maybe I need to bone up on cooling AMD chips. I would think that the retail version of the CPU, with heatsink and fan already attached, is sufficient. Naturally, I'll take care to ensure the case is sufficiently cooled.



Don't forget that many of these fancy cooling products are designed with overclockers in mind, who often push CPUs to the limit. I'll probably eventually give overclocking a try, but probably not until after the CPU warranty expires.



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Alex Garcia

[John]

Scuzzy, I have to say what I know of CPU shims you could write in one sentence. However, I started surfing and reading some articles on the net. A lot of people are confused about what CPU shims are supposed to do. Some people believe the shims help in cooling especially if they are made of copper. While that sounds plausible it is not the case. CPU shims it seems are made to prevent cracking of the socket A/462 chip during installation. I also learned that there are a lot of CPU shims of many colors and designs on the market. Each manufacturer claiming to have the best. According to the articles that I have read the best is most likely the brand sold by Coolerguys Take a look at this article by Overclocker Cafe However you said that your going to purchase a Retail processor with heatsink and fan already attached so you wont need the shim. I might not buy the retail processor so I might consider a CPU shim. Anyone else have experience with CPU shims especially for Athlon socket A/462 I would be enjoy what you have to say.



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John

[scuzzy]

Okay, here's an update on my little project...



So far, I have most of the parts I need, with the exception of the 3 big ones. The motherboard I've been looking for is very difficult to get at this point (Epox 8KHA "Plus"). I've only been able to find it at Motherboards.com, which has HORRIBLE ratings for customer satisfaction.



So, I'm now considering buying the Shuttle AK31 V3.1 motherboard, which is about $25 cheaper, and has received *very* high ratings from several reviewers. Like the Epox 8KHA+, the Shuttle AK31 V3.1 is a VIA KT266A DDR solution. Another possibility is the highly rated MSI K7T266 Pro2-RU, which features USB 2 and Promise RAID controllers. Unfortunately, I can't seem to find these boards either.



Until I confirm a motherboard order, I'm relunctant to order a CPU and RAM. No particular reason, mind you, I'd just rather order them together. As for the CPU, I am beginning to consider the AMD Athlon XP 1800. I may as well go for the speed demon.



More on this later.



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Alex Garcia

[BlueIce]

here ya go buddy

Look in the motherboards here

http://www.ezstation.com/

This is all of the resellers for epox

http://www.epox.com/html/english/purchase/online.asp



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[pat]

Also available at:

http://www.pcnut.com/parts/epox.htm

Reseller rating:

http://www.resellerratings.com/vendone.cgi?PCNut

hth

pat



Whoops! sorry wrong number!



I see now that the HA uses via 266 and the 7A uses amd 761





Edited by - patman on Oct 19 2001  05:29:31 AM

[scuzzy]

Thanks for the links, guys. Here's what I ended up doing -



I went back to NewEgg.com this morning, and what do you know? They had the MSI K7T266-Pro2-RU MoBo available for $135. So, I went ahead and scarfed one up, and ordered the AMD XP1600 (1.4GHz) Palomino CPU along with the MoBo. After that order went through, I cruised on over to Crucial-dot-com, and promptly ordered 512MB of DDR PC2100 memory.



So, what was the big deal with the MSI board? In a nutshell:



1. Of the 3 boards I was considering, only the MSI was listed as AMD "XP" recommended.

2. Promise RAID controller is nice, even if I might not use it.

3. The diagnostic LEDs were a plus, even though it might not equal Epox's LED.

4. 8 USB connectors! 4 USB 1.1, and 4 USB 2.0 (which is 40x faster than USB 1.1)

5. Up to 3GB of RAM



Anyway, more on all of this later.



Oh, I'm considering the KDS Rad-5 flat panel monitor, which has received some high reviews. It also got the Editors' Choice award at C|net. The review is here.



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Alex Garcia

[John]

Scuzzy, I am considering the Asus A7V266-E for my Athlon XP-1700. Have you considered Asus motherboards at all.  Also about your decisiion on the LCD display the KDS RAD-5 can be purchased at Walmart. If you remember my report LCD 15in One of my choices was the KDS RAD-5. Either way good luck. Let me know about the MSI motherboard. Good luck,



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John



Edited by - John on Oct 19 2001  6:16:34 PM



Edited by - John on Oct 19 2001  6:25:02 PM

[scuzzy]

John,



Yes, I did consider the Asus A7V266-E for it's AGP Pro support, but not seriously enough. Part of my frustration with Asus is their site, which is often extremely slow or outright broken. This isn't something that's been going on for just a few days, or even weeks. I first hit the Asus site about 3 months ago, and it's almost constantly bogged down. It's rare that I can actually find what I'm looking for at asus.com. Personally, it's left a bad taste in my mouth. They may very well make fine motherboards, but it means nothing if I can't get a BIOS update because their site is down.



Aside from that, I took a big interest in the MSI board, thanks to the many features and the high reviews it received. The RAID support, and total of 8 USB connectors, was the deciding factors. It also helped that the northbridge only has a heatsink instead of a fan. I'm already going to have a total of six fans as it is (2 on case, 2 on power supply, 1 on CPU, and 1 on video card).



I do recall that the KDS was on your list of consideration. Aside from the high reviews the RAD-5 received, I also like it's nice looks - very sleek looking. I'm also glad that Wal-Mart carries it, since I can get a 10% discount there thanks to my son who works there.



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Alex Garcia

[John]

Scuzzy, I just orderd the Epox EP-8KHA plus and AMD XP 1600 retail processor from www.newegg.com for $288.00 and 512MB DDR 2100 RAM from www.crucial.com for $70.57  Total price so far $358.57 Haven't decided on a case yet. I have most of the other components already. On the good side my calble company has started installing fiberoptic cable for digital cable service. Maybe by the beginning of next year I can get Broadband service. Right now DSL is out of the question as the Telephone switching office is to far away. Have to stick with 56K for a while longer.



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John

[scuzzy]

John,



I'm sorry that broadband isn't an option for you, at least not yet. On that note, Sprint is no longer seeking new customers for its wireless broadband market. Current customers will continue to receive service (who knows for how long), but absolutely no more new customers. Those who had a work order for new service are out of luck, too. You can get the news first-hand here, and make sure you check the FAQ page while you're there.



What a shame, as the service has been excellent to date.



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Alex Garcia

[scuzzy]

John,



One other thing, unless you have a specific case in mind, it is challenging to find the right one for your needs. Be careful with the Epox 8KHA motherboard, as some of the reviews I read complained that some capacitors (near where the CD-ROM drive is mounted) are somewhat tall, preventing the CD-ROM from installing properly. Of course, it will depend on the size of the case you buy, and where the CD-ROM installs in relation to the motherboard.



Anyway, I did quite a bit of searching for cases, so let me know if I can help. Some of the cases I looked at received very high reviews for their usability and cooling capacities, but these types of cases were often considered very noisy. Most cases that do get reveiwed are often done so with overclocking in mind, which didn't help me very much.



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Alex Garcia

[John]

Scuzzy, I read a report concerning the problem you poasted. I have a spare Enlight 7237 Mid Tower that I was going to use somewhere else. It should work I've used these cases with Athlon Slot A processors with no problem so their should be room. I hope. This is the case Enlight It's an excellent all around case for either Pentium 4 or Athlon socket or slot. It has a removeable motherboard tray and two 80mm case fans one front one back. It takes only two screws to open the entire case. Including the front and both sides. It's large and roomy and easy to work in. At least this way I don't have to buy another case. I was considering the Antec SX1030 The Antec has lots of room and 3 case fans plus those on the power supply, processor, Chip cooler, and video card. Thats a lot of fans. Maybe later. I have to save money somehow right!



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John

[scuzzy]

I'm looking to build a computer, and I would like to get some input from you folks. Basically, I want to build a powerhouse that I can turn around and sell. I'm not looking to make a profit, so much as gaining some experience. However, I do want to put together a quality machine, using only quality components. I'm not too concerned with costs, so long as I'm able to recover the money when I sell the machine. So, I don't want to load it up with frivolous components, nor do I want to make it extravagant.



I would rather not use an Intel P4, only because I refuse to use RDRAM memory. However, I will reconsider if the motherboard supports a P4 with SDRAM. Asus has one, known as the P4B, which supports Intel's latest Socket 478. I have no idea what the price is, though. I'll consider Intel or AMD, the latter being my preference. Performance is important, so I don't want to use a low end chip.



A possible setup:



1.4GHz AMD Athlon (maybe PIII 1GHz)

256MB RAM (Crucial, of course)

ATX case and power supply? Who knows? PC Power and Cooling?

Motherboard - Asus? Abit? Epox? (I don't want any ISA slots)

Either a DVD-ROM, or a Kenwood True 72x CD-ROM

Yamaha CD-R/W 2200EZ (20x10x40x)

Maxtor HDD 40GB to 60GB

ATI Radeon 32 DDR or 64DDR

Turtle Beach Santa Cruz sound card

10/100 Network card

No Modem

Probably Windows XP Home



Anyway, nothing is firm as of yet. Your thoughts on this is appreciated.



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Alex Garcia