New build, parts are here

[scuzzy]

Our oldest daughter will graduate medical school this upcoming August 2005. I am planning on building a really nice system for her, and I would like advice from the experts.

As for requirements, it needs to be a high-performance system that will be used for photo editing, viewing DVD movies, occasional gaming, and general use. She is also very much into MP3s. The OS will be WinXP Pro, and will include MS Office Professional.

I am not looking for the latest/greatest that money can possibly buy, but I'm not looking to put together a cheap system, either. I want a mid-size Lian-Li case, and a PS in the 400+ watt category. For a monitor, I will look for a 19" to 20" LCD when it's closer to August; possibly a wide-screen model.

As for the CPU - only AMD will be considered. The system will also require a high-quality sound card capable of rocking down the house. As for a graphics card, I favor ATI, and will consider an All-In-Wonder model.

Thanks for your ideas.

[Carskick]

An Athlon64 3200+, 3400+, or 3500+ would probably be the best choices for a good compromise between cost and performance, and of course they are best for gamming. Get the 939 socket. It's the fastest and it will be around the longest.

For video, an ATI X600 or Nvidia 6600GT would probably be in the right are for good gaming and not costing too much. I think there is an ATI X600 AIW.

For the hard drive, get a Western Digital 160GB, maybe? I guess it depends what she uses it for. If she is recording video, You could get something like a WD 200GB and a WD 120GB, and use one as the slave for purely video storage. This would allow her to more easily do other stuff while video recording.

For optical, get the NEC ND-3500A. I just got one, and it's fantastic. Anandtech also rated it one of the best DVD-Burners around.

I'll add more specifics shortly.

[Carskick]

Lian Li Black Mid-Tower Case, Model "PC-78B USB" -RETAIL
$85.00

Antec 430W Power Supply, Model "TRUE430" - Retail
$75
(A Thermaltake could be a cheaper alternative)

AMD Athlon 64 3200+, 512KB L2 Cache, Socket 939 64-bit Processor - Retail
$233.00

GIGABYTE "GA-K8NS-939" NVIDIA nForce3 ULTRA Chipset Motherboard For AMD Socket 939 CPU -RETAIL
$85.00
 
Corsair XMS Extreme Memory Speed Series, (Twin Pack) 184 Pin 1GB(512MBx2) DDR PC-3200 - Retail
$198.00

Western Digital 200GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive, Model WD2000JB, OEM Drive Only
$114.00
   
Western Digital 160GB 7200RPM IDE Hard Drive, Model WD1600JB, OEM Drive Only
$93

XFX nVIDIA GeForce 6600GT Video Card, 128MB GDDR3, 128-Bit, Dual DVI, AGP 8X, Model "PVT43AND" -RETAIL
$225.00

NEC 16X Double Layer DVD?RW Drive, Black, Model ND-3520A BK, OEM
$63.99
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That's all 1171.99 + shipping

The monitor is more of a personal prefrence, but LG and Samsung would be good brands to look at, and you've got the OS already chosen. I'm not that experienced with sound cards, but the integrated isn't bad on this, but if you want better, you could always get an Audigy 2 or something. So there ya go. Good luck with this, and let me know what you think.

[Chandler]

I agree with pretty much everything Carskick has suggested.  Definately go for the S939 A64 since it has dual-channel memory support and since the memory controller is on the CPU itself it actually does some good, unlike on the nForce2+AXP where the difference is negliable.

For sound, look at either the Audigy 4 Pro (which is a true prosumer card but a bit OTT for most people), the Audigy 2 ZS (still very good) or something based on VIA's Envy24 chipset such as the M-Audio Revolution 7.1 or Philips Ultimate Edge.  The advantage of the Envy24 cards is that they don't come with bloatware to bog the system down.  They're not as good for gaming since they lack hardware 3D sound acceleration but for MP3 and Home-Theatre they're pretty much unbeatable.

If you do decide to stick with onboard sound, check what codec it is using.  Realtek aren't the best although they may sound "OK".  I can definately hear the difference between Realtek ALC650/655/658 and even the old Aureal Vortex 2 but a lot of it depends on how well the motherboard manufacturer has designed their boards.

[Mark H]

Look at the system I built and get ideas from it. You can reduce the number of hard drives and get an ATI graphics card to save money over the 6800 I bought. You can also downgrade the RAM to 512 MB, but if she is using Adobe Photoshop, I recommend a minimum of 1 MB of RAM. The system I built was designed to handle Photoshop CS and 6 to 100 MB digital photo files. I also may add a card and use it to copy some home VHS videos to DVD.

Mark H

[Chandler]

Have you thought about noise levels?  In my opinion these make a huge difference to the enjoyment of a system so take a look at quiet fans.  Arctic Cooling make some very nice, innovative fans for CPU, case and graphics cards (although fitting the latter will void graphics card warranty unfortunately).

We've got a new Celeron based system at work - nice and quiet at idle, but the minute the CPU is loaded above around 50% the leaf blower starts up and it is easily the noisiest PC in the office.  All the more reason to go AMD - much cooler running.

[Mark H]

Yes, go with the AMD 939 chips. I went with Panaflo fans and my new system is quieter with 5 of these than the other system with 4 Antec fans. Noise level lowering is worth the extra cost of replacing some stock fans.

[Carskick]

I agree with pretty much everything Carskick has suggested.  Definately go for the S939 A64 since it has dual-channel memory support and since the memory controller is on the CPU itself it actually does some good, unlike on the nForce2+AXP where the difference is negliable.

For sound, look at either the Audigy 4 Pro (which is a true prosumer card but a bit OTT for most people), the Audigy 2 ZS (still very good) or something based on VIA's Envy24 chipset such as the M-Audio Revolution 7.1 or Philips Ultimate Edge.  The advantage of the Envy24 cards is that they don't come with bloatware to bog the system down.  They're not as good for gaming since they lack hardware 3D sound acceleration but for MP3 and Home-Theatre they're pretty much unbeatable.

If you do decide to stick with onboard sound, check what codec it is using.  Realtek aren't the best although they may sound "OK".  I can definately hear the difference between Realtek ALC650/655/658 and even the old Aureal Vortex 2 but a lot of it depends on how well the motherboard manufacturer has designed their boards.

Nice points, Chandler. The board I pointed ouyt has the ALC850 codec. My PC uses the ALC650, and I use it mainly for music and games, with sufficent results. The Nforce 2 forceware has an EQ that does a pretty good job. Whether it's a hardware or software EQ, I don't know, but it's pretty good. You may not want to turn the volume really high, as it will distort. Keep it about 50% volume, and turn the speakers up, and the quality will be very good. The main reasons to get an external card would be if you need digital inputs or outputs, need audiophile quality on your computer (You should have great speakers for this as well), or if you want slightly better system performance due to a stronger sound processor. The ALC650 that I have can do something like 24 or 30 3D sounds at a time, while the ALC850 is probably even better, so it should be fine for her. If not, you can always upgrade later.

[scuzzy]

Thanks for the great reply, guys. As soon as I get a chance, I'll come back and add some thoughts here.

[scuzzy]

Okay, I' finally getting started on putting this system together. I have 4 months to build it, and I will piece it together as I'm able. To start, I will be picking up a case in the near future.

The motherboard, CPU, and RAM will likely be the last items I pick up. However, I'm leaning toward the EPOX EP-9NDA+ mobo (thanks, Chandler), AMD Athlon 64 3500. For the RAM, I'll look at Carskick's advice for 1GB of Corsair.

I'm undecided on HDD and Video. Probably Seagate or WD for the drive, but it will be SATA only to reduce cable clutter. The video card will likely be ATI based, but I will consider Carskick's advice for nVIDIA.

The DVD burner will be Plextor's SATA drive (PX-716SA), again to reduce cable clutter. Software will be the retail version of Nero 6.

For PSU, I'll likely get the Antec True430.

I'll keep you folks updated. Meanwhile, thanks for the great ideas.

[Chandler]

Here's some more things to consider:
Case
Fong Kai FK330 - wow, if this was available in the UK I would buy it in a heartbeat
Evercase ECE-4252 - cheap with very good airflow

Hard Disks
Samsung - very quiet
Western Digital - high quality, some quiet models out
Hitachi - cheap and good performance
Seagate - high quality

Optical Drive
LG - cheap and excellent performance and features
Toshiba - high quality
Plextor - high quality
(I run the IDE cable for this behind the motherboard so it doesn't look all that messy)

Graphics Card
Galaxy Glacier 6800GT AGP - comes pre-fitted with NV Silencer for quietness and will also exhaust heat straight out of the case
GeForce 6600GT - good performance and pretty cheap (better value than the 9800 Pro IMHO)
ATI cards seem to require slightly less power - so run cooler

CPU
A64 3200+ 90nm - cheaper than the 3500+ but if you can afford it then by all means go for the 3500+.  Make sure you get a 90nm Winchester though

[scuzzy]

Holy cow, what a great case. Thanks for the heads-up.

Fong Kai FK330 Review

[scuzzy]

Well, forget it. Dang it.

It seems Directron was the only supplier carrying this product. Unfortunately, Directron claims it is no longer available.  :(

[Ace]

I would be glad to put together your new system for you.  I feel I have a level of experience and expertise unmatched by anyone in the chatroom.  If you send me all the parts, plus a nominal assembly fee.

I would also offer that there are some "missing" components, that you might find important if not necessary:

1. a power strip.  I think mine's a Belden.  I'll check when I get home.  It allows you to plug stuff in, and I find it invaluable for efficient computer operation.
2. A mouse.  I have one with a cord, but it has that red light optical thingy, so it's pretty cool.  Except when the cord gets tangled around the end of the power strip ("Belden") and I have to yank it out and reset it to the mouse pad.
3. Oh. A mouse pad.  Mine has one of those wrist rests, for my carpal tunnel.  Of course, it's all dented from use so hardly supportive, if you catch my drift.
4. A keyboard.  Mine's the same brand as the mouse. It has those extra buttons you can program to call up a site, like this one (Community) or shopping (Amazon) or whatever the heading is.
5. A CRT monitor.  I'm sorry, but LCD's are a pain to me with my glasses/vision.  And the side view is lousy.  If I have guests in, and they have to sit off to the side, they'd go blind.  Well, so am I, in using a dang LCD with its stupid resident setting.  
6. one of those extension USB 2.0 thingys.  I use that for the keyboard and mouse, plus my camera to plug into.
7. A digital camera.  It sure helps in taking and poasting photos, here.
8. A couple CD holders, that i use to hold CDs and disks. And drugstore receipts until I can toss them.
9. A box for floppies.  I've got floppies saved from years ago.  All sorts of stuff.  Of course, can't pull a darn thing from some because I don't have the dang software the stuff was written on. (Broderbund...)
10. I can't think of anything else, but had to do this since it's a top ten list.  Consider this "other duties as assigned."

Ace; Oh, and yell if you try to hook up 3 controllers or have to reseat the memory in the thing. I get that stuff right the first time.

[Whizbang]

I agree that this case is supurb.  Here is the USA address info.  I just emailed for info on dealers in the US.

Fong Kai USA, Inc
Direct Factory Support

900 Alpha Road #420
Richardson, Texas 75081 USA
Tel:    972-644-1584

Toll:    972-644-5343

[scuzzy]

Thanks, Whizbang. I'll see what I can do with the info.

[Whizbang]

They also listed an 888 call number, but I received some strange automated response about not being able to use that number from my location.  As I have said, there are a lot of places that you cannot get to from Arkansas.   ::)

[Ace]

Geez Louise.  It's Texas.  Isn't that like a local number?

Fine.  I'll call them too, for you.  And put the dang thing together.  And you're not getting a red one, unless the thing gets here finally.

Ace; being a computer techie is not easy.  For me.

[Neon]

It's a local call for me. Let me know if I can assist.

[scuzzy]

Well, thanks for the help/advice. I contacted Fong Kai over the case, and I am awaiting a reply.

On another note, I went ahead and ordered a Seagate 160GB SATA hard drive from NewEgg. The cost was $106 + $.99 S/H.

[Whizbang]

Well, thanks for the help/advice. I contacted Fong Kai over the case, and I am awaiting a reply.

On another note, I went ahead and ordered a Seagate 160GB SATA hard drive from NewEgg (click here for details). The cost was $106 + $.99 S/H.

They did answer the phone?  Please pass on what you find.

[scuzzy]

Yes, I spoke with someone or another who transferred me to another person. He gave me some advice, suggesting the FK-333. Unfortunately, it's not available anywhere. But he's willing to work with me to sell me one directly from the factory stock. A couple emails have been exchanged, and I agreed to make a payment via PayPal - no credit cards are accepted.

Anyway, I'm waiting to hear back from him to make arrangements for payment. The grand total is around $135. I'll keep you folks updated as things move forward.

[Whizbang]

That is really strange that cases of that quality have no known retail outlet.  I ran into a similar problem with two aluminum cases that Akida was selling.  One had the whole inside mobo and power supply frame on a roll-out rack.  The other had quick connects for all the drives.  I was going to get one but found that they had been discontinued.

[scuzzy]

Firstly, I mustn't forget to thank Ace for his offer that I'm quickly going to dismiss as another "Jester Scheme". Although I considered it for just a second, I didn't want a computer with a toaster attached to the mouse port.

Secondly, I just send payment via PayPal to Fong Kai for $134.31. When the case is received, I'll update you folks on the details. Yes, I made sure the case has a restricted delivery to me, and not to Ace.

Thirdly, the Mitsumi USB 2.0/Floppy Drive unit arrived yesterday. It looks great, much better than I expected, and is the same size as a standard floppy unit. Hopefully, it will perform as well as it looks. Which, by the way, looks great. :)

[scuzzy]

Update: I'm considering the ASUS A8N-E nForce4 Motherboard, along with the Rosewill ATI Radeon X800XL Video Card (PCI-E). But I'm not entirely sure if I want to go with PCI-E route.

If I stay with AGP, I'm considering the ASUS K8N-E Deluxe nForce3 Motherboard, along with an undetermined ATI based video card. I *really* like the ATI cards, so it's unlikely that I'll stray. Anything is possible at this point, though.

As for the CPU, the more I think about it, the more likely I'll get the AMD 64 3200+ Winchester Core. I may consider something faster if the prices drop sufficiently within the next 3 months.

As always, your thoughts are welcomed.

[Whizbang]

My opinion here would be like my giving you my opinion on Cadillacs.  I have seen 'em only at a distance.

[Chandler]

AFAIK the Winchester core is only available in S939 format.  Some good boards I considered are:
- ASUS A8V-Deluxe (make sure it's a revision 2.0 - typical ASUS really ;))
- MSI K8N Neo2 Platinum
- Gigabyte GA-K8NS-939

I've got no complaints with the EPoX EP-9NDA3J, and there's also the more feature-rich EP-9NDA3+.  The main reason I picked it over the MSI or Gigabyte was due to it's layout, which had quite specific demands for my cooling equipment (CPU socket needs to "face" exhaust, space needed around AGP for VGA Silencer and passive cooling).

By all accounts the VIA K8T800 Pro chipset is just as good as the nVidia nForce3 Ultra (200Gb Ultra) from a performance perspective, but I can't comment on things like USB which is somewhere VIA has always been let down for me.  I would have gone for the ASUS A8V-Deluxe had there not been that uncertainty but I needed a reliable USB controller, and I had relatively few issues with nVidia.

[Carskick]

From what I've seen on NewEgg, the PCI Express versions of the latest graphics cards are generally cheaper than the AGP version, and about the same in speed. PCI Express offers no benefit now, but the Nforce 4 is a better chipset, and the PCI Express maybe nice in the future.

[scuzzy]

Duh. I failed to notice that the Asus board I mentioned was not Socket 939. I don't know how in heck I missed that. Oh well, strike that one dead.

I still have about 2 to 3 months before I make the MoBo purchase, so I'll see what's the best bet then.

Thanks for the advice, and I'll continue searching my options. PCI-E is looking better. :)

[Chandler]

PCI-e has more bandwidth available etc but there are some limitations:
- nForce4 apparently has some PCI issues.  Bandwidth maxes out wrt CPU load (at 60% CPU load the bandwidth drops for some reason).  Intel PCIe chipsets have a similar problem but it's not as bad.  No such problem on AGP chipsets.
- PCIe boards only have 2 or 3 PCI slots.  If you intend to use onboard sound etc you may not find this a limitation, but for me it was (I need 2 TV tuners and a sound card).
- Some (older or badly written) DirectX applications/games don't like PCIe boards (as they don't see AGP they make an assumption).